batmanmg wrote:ummm no it means neither of them are. and quite possibly there is no physcal point in our space that is the center. but a center an expansion still makes.
Yes, it means that neither of them are. And if you apply the same argument to any combination of points in the universe the same argument will always hold. Thus, there is no center of the universe. I don't think I see what you mean by "center of expansion" and "center of the universe"...to me, if the universe is expanding then the center of the universe would be the center of expansion, no? Applying Occam we don't exist in a higher-dimensional hyperspace, so then the center of expansion would then necessarily be a point in the universe itself. Since the universe is homogeneous and isotropic there is no center contained in it and thus no center of expansion.
Is your definition different than mine?
batmanmg wrote:you talked about the baloon. well that balloon has a center, regardless of what you say. it may not be a point in the physical universe, but its still there. if you make the radius of the baloon = 0 it becomes a point.. that point is in fact the centere.
If I make the radius of the balloon = 0 then all points are contained at the one single "center"...if I blow up the balloon (just like the universe is expanding) then all the points grow further apart but which of them was the initial "center" point? Turns out that they all were. It's a mathematical certainty...and since "center" implies "singular" then we're dealing with a paradox and we necessarily have to admit that there never was a center to begin with.
batmanmg wrote:and im assuming that the matter isn't expanding along with the universe? or is it.
Yes it is. Every single thing in the universe is expanding, every single point between atoms is expanding, every single point between quarks is expanding. You are getting expanded as you read this.
batmanmg wrote:either way. the distance between all the objects will get close enough that if there are several black holes. everthing well get sucked up into them. and each of them will get close enough to eachother that they will get sucked up into eachother. that leaves one really big black hole.. maybe not at the physical center of the universe. but its the only thing left in it.
If the universe expands faster than the rate of creation of black holes then the expansion will trump the collapse forced by black holes and the universe will continue to expand until black hole creation hits a critical limit (if such a thing exists). I'm more than happy to be taken incorrectly on this point though because I've no idea what the critical limit would be offhand.