Negative mass

[arsenic]

I think when some object has negative mass it will have accerelation vecter oppersite from force vector


Exsample a box weighted -5 kilograms and you push it with 5 newton force the box will move at the oppersite way that you push it

F=ma
5=-5a
a=-1

the box will has accerelation = 1 m/s^2 in oppersite direction from your force

I have some question

Will the negative mass relate to 4d

[alkaline]

here is an article that explains why there is no such thing as negative mass:

http://www.physlink.com/Education/AskExperts/ae257.cfm

to quote the article: "Not everything that has a mathematical meaning has a physical meaning."

[arsenic]

mass is not 100% related to volume
some objects such as plastic may have a little mass but have big volume
some objects such as steel may have much mass but have small volume

so negative mass do not mean negative volume

The only reason that I have found that why negative mass cannot existed
is
gravity= G*m1*m2 /r^2
if m1 is negative and m2 is negative gravity will be positive and this will
make negative mass disintregrated in to very very very small mass

[Keiji]

if an object has negative mass, each atom would try to get away from the ones beside it. thus the object on earth would remain intact because of air pressure, but on a non-atmosphere-bearing body such as the Moon, or just in plain old space, it would disintegrate immediately and stuff would fly out all over the place. it would also be repelled from a body if said body had no atmosphere to keep it down.

[RQ]

This certainly would disprove anitparticles. According to Hawking, without antimatter, black holes would not be able to make quantum foam. True there may not be negative volume, but mass is not distance. I guess that would make it have negative density. However Hawking says that a neutron is made up of two down quarks with a -1/3 charge and one up quark with a +2/3 charge making it add up to 0. Then a proton is two up and one down quarks adding up to a total of -1/3 (quite controversial). Now quarks have 6 "flavors" - up, sown, strange, charmed, bottom, and top. Each comes in three "colors" green, red, and blue. Of course there are also antiquarks for each of the 18 different quarks. He says that gravity is just gravitons exchanged inbetween matter which pull them together and it has a spin 2. Matter has a 1/2 spin, or each particle has to make two complete revolutions before reaching the same position it started from. in matter the electrons have a 1/2 spin, which also predicts that they should have a partner called the antielectron, or positron. The electromagnetic force is the exchange of electrons, but when that occurs it releases a photon which makes up light and they have a spin 1. The weak nuclear force makes radioactivity and only acts on matter with spin 1/2. They said that there were 3 other particles with spin -1, known as massive vector bosons, which carried the weak force. W+, W-, and Z 0 (z naught) and had a mass of about 100 GeV or 100 giga electron volts which is the electricity of one electron to another. At energies greater than that they would all behave in a similar manner, making them however work at very short distances with a lot of power. Then the strong nuclear force is the force that holds quarks in the protons and neutrons and that holds the protons and neutrons in the nuclear which is the gluon with a spin -1 and interacts only with other gluons and quarks. Quarks cannot be alone, because they have color and have to be joined in a "string" of the 3 different colors. 3 quarks and antiquarks make a meson which is unstable, because the quarks and antiquarks can annihilate themselves. Now since the three colors add up to white, or neutral, there have to be gluons of the three different colors to add up to white, which it says forms an unstable particle called glueball. Also I think that gravitons are made up of gravitinos and neutrinos.

[Keiji]

However Hawking says that a neutron is made up of two down quarks with a -1/3 charge and one up quark with a +2/3 charge making it add up to 0. Then a proton is two up and one down quarks adding up to a total of -1/3 (quite controversial).

Since when did 2/3*2-1/3 make 1/3? It adds up to 3/3 if you ask me...

Now quarks have 6 "flavors" - up, sown, strange, charmed, bottom, and top. Each comes in three "colors" green, red, and blue.

WTF!! There are only 2 types of quarks, up and down.

[RQ]

It's two down quarks with spin -1/3 and one up quark with spin 2/3. and no there are 6"flavors" (it's just a type, not an actual flavor and they are all part of the different forces of nature) and there are 3 "colors" because quarks cannot stay alone, they have to be in a group of three to make a particle, or a meson, or glueball.

[Keiji]

you are so rediculous... :?

[arsenic]

negative mass is just a mass that has acceleration vector in an oppersite
direction of force vector

and I think imaginary mass is some kind of mass that has acceration vector which is pi/2 radian angle from force vector



negative mass
------------>force vector
<------------acceration vector
force vector and acceration vector
is in an oppersite direction

positive mass
------------>force vector
------------>acceration vector
force vector and acceration vector
is in a same direction

imaginary mass
------------>force vector
^acceration vector
:
:
:
force vector and acceration vector do pi/2 radian angle
from force vector

[arsenic]

from
E =mc^2
if you can tranform more than 100% mass to energy the negative mass
will appear

exsample
a cube of steel that has mass = 5 kilograms

when you tranform mass into energy the mass of steel will be decrease
from 5 kilograms to less than 5 kilogram

if you tranform 5 kilogram of mass in to energy
the cube of steel will have 0 kilogram of mass
you will get massive energy and 0 kilogram of mass

if you still tranform mass to energy althorgh the cube of steel
has 0 kilogram of mass the negative mass will appear
and you will get more energy

you will get negative mass and energy more than 5*c^2



What enviroment that negative mass can live

I think negative mass can live in place that has no gravity
From gravity = G*m1*m2/r^2
if G = 0 there will be no gravity and the negative mass can live


If we get the negative mass how can we use it
I think negative mass has incredibly potential in pushing object
even a very small object that has negativemass can push a black hole
because it has acceration vector in an oppersite direction of force vector

[Aale de Winkel]

WTF!! There are only 2 types of quarks, up and down.

last time I checked ther where still three families of particles so 6 quarks
properties of which can be found in:
http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/Quark.html
those quarks form families with the three leptons described in:
http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/Lepton.html
where also the coresponding neutrinos are listed.

since quarks are not seen seperately they are glued together into colorneutral particles, thus glued give always an integral multiple of the electron charge. As well as other properties, the above articles provide relevant links to other pages for those interested in particle physics!
.

[alkaline]

negative mass is just a mass that has acceleration vector in an oppersite
direction of force vector

Mass is a scalar quantity, not a vector. Thus this makes no sense.

and I think imaginary mass is some kind of mass that has acceration vector which is pi/2 radian angle from force vector

So anything moving sideways is imaginary? this is just silly. Mass is changed by your speed when you are close to the speed of light, but otherwise the difference is too small to be noticeable.

[alkaline]

from
E =mc^2
if you can tranform more than 100% mass to energy the negative mass
will appear

No, you can't. Where are you getting this idea from?

exsample
a cube of steel that has mass = 5 kilograms

when you tranform mass into energy the mass of steel will be decrease
from 5 kilograms to less than 5 kilogram

There are no equations that say this.

What enviroment that negative mass can live

I think negative mass can live in place that has no gravity
From gravity = G*m1*m2/r^2
if G = 0 there will be no gravity and the negative mass can live

If you have a gravitational constant that equals zero, you don't have a universe.

If we get the negative mass how can we use it
I think negative mass has incredibly potential in pushing object
even a very small object that has negativemass can push a black hole
because it has acceration vector in an oppersite direction of force vector

You can't have acceleration in a different direction than force! this is just absurd!

[Geosphere]

Acceleration opposite of force? LOL

Are you maybe thinking about deceleration or something?

[Aale de Winkel]

from
E =mc^2
if you can tranform more than 100% mass to energy the negative mass
will appear

No, you can't. Where are you getting this idea from?

In principle one can, matter energy conversion isn't invented yet, so startrek transporters aren't possible yet (as far as I know). The enormous computer capacity needed to keep track of the particles/energies involved is one of the problems.

However down to the elementairy particles matter/energy conversion is common pratice, when particles are colliding together out of the energie soup other particles reemerge, it is this particle/energy dualisms that make us express the mass of the particles expressed in MeV The speed of light being scaled to 1 regularly.
.

[alkaline]

Oh i know conversion between energy and mass is possible, I was just saying that converting more than 100% of that mass to energy is impossible.

[arsenic]

negative mass is just a mass that has acceleration vector in an oppersite
direction of force vector

Mass is a scalar quantity, not a vector. Thus this makes no sense.

and I think imaginary mass is some kind of mass that has acceration vector which is pi/2 radian angle from force vector

So anything moving sideways is imaginary? this is just silly. Mass is changed by your speed when you are close to the speed of light, but otherwise the difference is too small to be noticeable.

some scalar quantity can be negative
such as work (work = force *distance that object move)
negative work appear when force is in oppersite direction
form object move

Exsample of negative work
friction(the force that always happen when you push object on the floor
) produce a negative work


for imaginary mass the object can move in side way when you push it

imaginary mass is not same as positive mass

negative mass still a scalar quantity and it means that mass has acceration
vector in the oppersite way of your force

F= ma
if m= negative
and F=positive
then a=negative
negative in physic means oppersite direction from positive
so accrelation vector will be in oppersite way of your force vector

[Aale de Winkel]

Oops sorry, alkaline, I missed the "more" part.

Arsenic, curious notion though, regularly opposites attract while same signs repel.
pe try to join two magnets south south, north north.
With gravity one have masses of equal sign attract one another.
and opposite sign repel. :wink:

Though the math may be sound, the physics is couriously opposed to the regular. Perhaps the reason for the difficulty in formulating a unified theory :twisted: (I haven't the foggiest what the status of that one is :? )
.

[RQ]

It's all relative. It may appear so but unless it's in negative time it's not negative.

[arsenic]

I think some kind of mass is related to 4d

If there is some kind of mass that has acceration vector in marp or garp direction when you push it in 3d direction that kind of mass should be some kind of mass that is not positive ,negative ,imaginenary,complex

complex mass is the mass that has accrelation vector in some angle
which is not pi/2 radian,-pi/2 radian such as the mass that has accrelation in pi/4 radian from force vector is a complex mass

[Aale de Winkel]

I think some kind of mass is related to 4d

If there is some kind of mass that has acceration vector in marp or garp direction when you push it in 3d direction that kind of mass should be some kind of mass that is not positive ,negative ,imaginenary,complex

complex mass is the mass that has accrelation vector in some angle
which is not pi/2 radian,-pi/2 radian such as the mass that has accrelation in pi/4 radian from force vector is a complex mass

As Alkaline already stated, mass is a scalar entity of the object. If you want to make it an octernion number go ahead, but it is hardly of any meaning.

If the mass is accellerated in marp or garp, it simply means that there is some tetronian force acting upon it. Emily plucked a star from the swock our universe is on, which present itself to us as a dying star. (supposing once more that "dimension (size)" increase upon "dimension (number)", so that Emily can "pluck a star")

The force vector doesn't say anything about the masses number system, as said it simply states the direction of the forces source. The complex plane might be used to describe bionian space, a pair of complex numbers might describe tetronian space, but aside from being a quite natural system for object like the duocircle (I guess), I prefer a vector of four real numbers as it easily expans to the even more dimension.

Perhaps Emily find it quite natural to expres things in quaternions, just as the metamorph lady in "moon base alpha" calculated by head faster then alpha's computers, since her natural number system was eliptically based (whatever that means), perhaps quaternion calculation are fast when one is used to them, and it looks to me like quite a natural system for tetraspace.
.

[arsenic]

only positive mass has accreration vector in same directon of force vector

If mass is not positive and there is only one force to push it it will
move in some direction but not in the same direction of the force vector

exsample

negative mass has accrelation vector in oppersite direction of force vector
so even you pull it with 10000000000 newtons of force it will not come close to you

<------------------your force vector
--------------------> the negative mass will move in this way even there is only one force(your force) to pull it

[Aale de Winkel]

only positive mass has accreration vector in same directon of force vector

If mass is not positive and there is only one force to push it it will
move in some direction but not in the same direction of the force vector

exsample

negative mass has accrelation vector in oppersite direction of force vector
so even you pull it with 10000000000 newtons of force it will not come close to you

<------------------your force vector
--------------------> the negative mass will move in this way even there is only one force(your force) to pull it

Yeh, positive mass accellerates while negative mass decellerates (and repels), complex mass shears, octernionic mass hybernates( ?)

Just what you put in the equations I gather, but it is hardly of physical use
though it might be fun to toy around with these ideas. :twisted:

having a force acting on some IC-mass, and suddenly the object acellerates sideways, perpendicular to the forces direction.
there might be some mathematical fun in the resulting equations
.

[RQ]

Perhaps Einstein's formula for accelaration might be of use
the force of gravity between two objects:
although one is moving mass and the other is resting mass, they should cancel each other out:

m1a=m2G/R^2
a=G/R^2 I don't really think this is right, but I think I read it somewhere.

[alkaline]

only positive mass has accreration vector in same directon of force vector

If mass is not positive and there is only one force to push it it will
move in some direction but not in the same direction of the force vector

Where are you getting these "facts", anyway? Did you just make them up and decide they made sense? Have you observed real physics like this? Have you read books on this topic?

[Polyhedron Dude]

I once thought of the possibility of negative mass, considering what elements with negative atomic numbers would be like - take element -74, we'll call it netsgnut (tungsten backwards) - if you dropped a piece of it, it will fall up and hit the ceiling, if you dropped it outside, you'll lose it forever, it will fall up through the stratosphere, and burn up in the ionosphere, the ashes of it would eventually soar out of the solar system and head out of the galaxy. If negative mass were possible, it would be no where near our galaxy. A negative mass object would be attracted to a negative mass planet though. BTW imagine what it would be like to "walk" (more like hang on to dear life) on a negative planet.

Polyhedron Dude

[RQ]

Pholigston theory uses the thought of negative matter, but it was abandoned. It said however that negative mass/matter was widely used in physics today.